The Bullroarer - Wednesday 20 August 2008

SMH - Australia's hot rocks may generate power

Australia is sitting on an "inexhaustible" source of energy, scientists say - and they're not talking about coal. "Hot rocks" energy is being touted as the latest solution to climate change. Australia's first hot rocks power station moved a step closer on Wednesday when the federal government launched a $50 million fund to commercialise the technology. Resources Minister Martin Ferguson said Australia's first hot rocks power plant could be built within four years.


SMH - Hot-rock industry stakes a claim

USING just 1 per cent of Australia's so-called "hot rocks" supply could produce 26,000 times the amount of energy that is now used each year. The figures, compiled by Geoscience Australia, were such a surprise to the office of the Minister for Resources, Martin Ferguson, that staff had them checked six times before releasing them. "The potential of the geothermal industry in Australia is truly staggering … It provides clean baseload power and is potentially a very important contributor to Australia's energy mix in a carbon-constrained world," Mr Ferguson said.

Bloomberg - Geothermal Energy May Supply 5% of Australia's Power

Business Spectator - Petratherm's Paralana promise

Petratherm has come out swinging saying that geothermal power, unlike wind power, can meet Australia’s grid demand for base load electricity supply. Managing director Terry Kallis said in a statement ahead of this week’s Australian Geothermal Energy Conference in Melbourne that Petratherm’s recently completed “dollar-for-megawatt” cost assessment of wind versus geothermal showed that the company’s Paralana project in South Australia would compete almost equally with wind power.

Google.org Blog - Enough geothermal energy to power the globe -- now that's hot!

Today, as part of our Renewable Energy Cheaper than Coal initiative, Google.org announced more than $10 million in investments and grants in Enhanced Geothermal Systems (EGS) technology. EGS expands the potential of traditional geothermal energy by orders of magnitude. The traditional geothermal approach relies on finding naturally occurring pockets of steam or hot water. The EGS process, by comparison, replicates these conditions by fracturing hot rock, circulating water through the system, and using the resulting steam to produce electricity in a conventional turbine. ...

Working with Geodynamics, one of the world's leading EGS development companies, we modeled Geodynamics' first 50 MW system at the Cooper Basin in SketchUp, Google's 3D modeling technology. To see how EGS works, check out the animation of the SketchUp model or download it.

Courier Mail - Underground plan for Brisbane

AN underground rail system for Brisbane's CBD is now being considered by the State Government following a year-long feasibility study into the project.

Courier Mail - Eco-friendly and cheap housing plan for Brisbane's north

THE State Government is devising a massive eco-friendly housing development in northern Brisbane which could rule out McMansions. It would also force developers to provide cheap housing. But there are already serious doubts about whether its plans are viable.

Business Spectator - Origin's valuation gamble

Origin Energy’s target statement is a curious document, designed more to put BG Group’s $13.8 billion into a holding pattern than as a comprehensive demolition of the merits of the offer. While Origin does go through the motions of presenting a conventional defence, extolling the virtues of its position as an "outstanding fuel-integrated generation and retail business," the core of the defence is its position in coal seam gas (CSG).

Business Spectator - Playing the climate card

In what may be a world first for a large takeover battle, Origin Energy has played heavily on its climate friendly credentials as it seeks to rebuff the $13.8 billion cash bid from England’s BG Group.

Bloomberg - Queensland Gas Offers A$837 Million for Sunshine Gas

Queensland Gas Co., one of five companies proposing a liquefied natural gas project in northeast Australia, agreed to buy Sunshine Gas Ltd. for at least A$837 million ($730 million), boosting reserves by almost a quarter. ... Queensland, Australia's third-biggest fuel-consuming state, will be the major contributor to demand growth and is set to become the biggest energy user by 2012, the government's commodities forecaster said in December. Queensland Gas said it will primarily use Sunshine's reserves to meet rising local demand, as well as to bolster a planned fuel-export project

SMH - Thousands of waterfront homes in danger: scientists

THE speed at which the climate is changing has been significantly underestimated, with thousands of Australian homes potentially at risk from rising sea levels, a conference has heard.

Bloomberg - LNG Project Delays May Cut 100 Million Tons of Supply

Delays in liquefied natural gas ventures led by Exxon Mobil Corp. and Chevron Corp. may pare global supplies by 100 million metric tons, more than the annual demand of South Korea and Japan, the world's biggest importers. Projects in Australia, Nigeria, Algeria and the Baltics have been shelved or postponed, prompting the capacity shortfall by 2013, said Ian Angell, vice president of gas and power at Wood Mackenzie Consultants Ltd. The deficit, enough to power 250 million homes, will cause spot LNG prices to trade at parity or at a premium to oil, he said.

Brisbane Times - Oil Search looks elsewhere in PNG

OIL SEARCH is looking to pick up more prospective areas in Papua New Guinea to help commercialise those of its gas resources not committed to an ExxonMobil-led $US11 billion ($12.6 billion) liquefied natural gas project.

Peak Energy - The Economist Debate On The "World Energy Crisis"

Energy Bulletin points to a debate starting at The Economist on whether or not "breakthrough innovations" are required to solve the energy crisis. My view is that we don't really need any "breakthroughs" - just incremental advances on todays technology and wide scale deployment.

The West Australian - Long-term power vision for Pilbara

Premier Alan Carpenter has announced plans for an integrated electricity system in the Pilbara to provide the region with a stable source of power. Campaigning in Karratha this morning, Mr Carpenter said his government had submitted the project to Infrastructure Australia, requesting commonwealth investment in the transmission infrastructure for one of Australia's biggest mining areas. He said there was widespread industry support for a modern Pilbara electricity system to replace the current “ad hoc” system based on gas and diesel-fired small to medium-sized plants, and that a grid system would provide a ready market for domestic gas and accelerate the development of smaller gas fields. ...

The Labor Party predicts power demands in the Pilbara will outstrip the South-West system that supplies Perth and the south-west region by 2013 and reach 6,000 megawatts by 2015. Peak demand in the south-west runs at about 3,000MW, according to the Department of Energy.

The Age - Pilbara power plan welcomed

The Centre of Excellence in Cleaner Production at Curtin University said an integrated system could lead to more efficient and reliable energy supply. "The current grid system ... has had a piecemeal approach and the government facilitating an integrated grid ... together with the main mining players ... should mean more efficient and reliable energy," director Michele John said. "Examples ... include wave and wind power on the coast, solar thermal furnaces, geothermal, solar-thermal energy and even algae to biofuels photo-bioreactors," Ms John said.

One more, from Online Opinion - A revolution in the transport economy

Public transport is a far more energy-efficient and is a less carbon-intensive alternative to petrol-driven vehicles. The Public Transport Users Association (PTUA) has surveyed the energy efficiency of public versus private transport. To break the figures down: an average petrol-run car will cost about 3.7 mega-joules (MJ) per passenger-kilometre (pkm). An electric train, however, operates at a rate of between 0.04 and 0.18 MJ pkm, making train transport as much as nine times more energy efficient.

From an energy-conscious and environmental perspective the imperative of prioritising increased public transport patronage and improving infrastructure and services is undeniable.

"an average petrol-run car will cost about 3.7 mega-joules (MJ) per passenger-kilometre (pkm). An electric train, however, operates at a rate of between 0.04 and 0.18 MJ pkm, making train transport as much as nine times more energy efficient."

Tristan Ewins' arithmetic is not very good.

3.7/0.18 = 20.56, and 3.7/0.04 = 92.5

Thus, electric trains are 21-93 times as energy-efficient.

Importantly, electric trains can get their electricity from lots of different sources, from coal, gas, nuclear, solar, wind, whatever. Whereas petrol-driven cars have to get their energy from petrol. They can be converted, but... it's easier to convert one power station than a million cars.

It is good to see that geothermal is getting increased backing.This has the potential to get Australia off coal generation for base load relatively quickly.Could we be so lucky?

Just the same,it would be wise to continue increased development of solar thermal/PV,wind and tidal.
The greater the spread of generation the more reliable and fail safe the grid will be.Electricity will be a major part of our energy for both fixed and mobile applications in the near future.

For those places where it is not economical to extend the grid then solar thermal/PV should be supported by government subsidy if we expect people to remain in these areas.There are still a lot of diesel generators chugging away out there.We could reduce our fuel import bill and help keep the remote area folk happy and productive.

On another note - there was a brief article in the Oz a few days ago about the proposal by a farmer in the Monaro area(I think)who formerly had some more or less high powered job,to build a desalination plant on the NSW South Coast and pump the water up to the Snowy resevoirs.It could be used to generate hydro power and then alleviate to some degree the water shortage in the Murray/Murrumbidgee.No suggestion as to what would power this scheme.

I thought initially that it was rather madcap and I didn't note a link.On further consideration it is probably not as silly as it sounds.

A couple of questions re geothermal. From the article...

Geothermal technology works by pumping water deep below the earth's surface, to areas which generate plenty of heat.

The water converts to steam and shoots back up to the surface, where it is used to make electricity.

Aren't Australia's "hot rocks" areas all inconveniently located in the outback? Where there's very little water? Where long-distance transmission lines have to be built?

Barry Goldstein, chairman of the Australian Geothermal Energy Group, said some US scientists believed hot rocks would be cheaper than coal in 10 years' time.

So even the people pushing the scheme admit it'll be expensive. I don't know if he took the (alleged) carbon trading scheme into consideration when comparing it with coal, but a 10 year period before its at parity with coal-generated electricity is hardly what I'd call "relatively quickly". He also says it'll be at least 2015 before there's a commercial generator in operation.

thirra: Just the same,it would be wise to continue increased development of solar thermal/PV,wind and tidal. The greater the spread of generation the more reliable and fail safe the grid will be.

I absolutely agree. If only we really were pursuing increased development of those things. What we're actually doing is making token efforts in those areas while ploughing untold sums of tax money into "clean coal" and (in NSW) selling off the publicly-owned generators to the highest bidder.

I absolutely agree. If only we really were pursuing increased development of those things. What we're actually doing is making token efforts in those areas while ploughing untold sums of tax money into "clean coal" and (in NSW) selling off the publicly-owned generators to the highest bidder.

The reason that "we" are not pursuing renewables as vigourously as you would like is that it doesn't stack up financially in the face of cheap coal. "We" also have a huge investment in coal fired technology that still has plenty of life in it and "we" don't feel inclined to pay more for electricity when we would rather buy a big plasma TV.

"We" really don't care where the power comes from, and we will vote for those who promise the lowest cost power with the best guilt reduction program to mitigate against any nasty side effects.

If the reports of geothermal being able to produce 26,000 times current demand are correct, then things could be much brighter than the doomers predict. Even 10 times would have been impressive. I'll believe it when I see it.

Our Plasma TVs certainly will be much brighter with 26,000 times the power!
;-)

(We may all have to wear welding goggles...!)

Aren't Australia's "hot rocks" areas all inconveniently located in the outback? Where there's very little water? Where long-distance transmission lines have to be built?

This has been discussed here before at some length :

http://anz.theoildrum.com/node/3215

Water - the great artesian basin. In any case, the idea is that it is a closed cycle - little water is lost in the process.

Grid - connect to the South Australian grid and/or the Queensland grid. The distances aren't that large. Sitting on a new interconnector between these 2 NEM regions would be perfect.

I wonder how much non-renewable fossil fuel energy was needed to find these "hot rocks"? I assume all the surveying was done with conventional vehicles. How much fossil fuel energy would be needed to build the transmission lines, to produce the materials needed in the creation of a geothermal plant and to maintain the infrastructure in working condition? How are the staff going to travel the long distances to central Australia without burning petrol? Are there alternatives to the petrochemicals that would be needed for the plastics and the insulation materials used to produce geothermal energy?

Just take the IT systems that manage power plants, all the various minerals (who'se production will be peaking soon) that are used in microchips have to be dug up, refined, transported to a factory, assembled and then installed on-site. All this stuff is now derived from oil. Until geothermal power can be produced without relying on all these high quality liquid fuel inputs downstream it is not a viable alternative, it is just another grasp of an oily straw.

What a strange mix of ignorance, doom and false dilemma.

#1 The "hot rock" resource was deliniated by oil and gas companies in their search for gas, which they found. A later analysis of the drilling data indicated that the energy stored as heat in the rocks, if it could be extracted, was orders of magnitude greater than that in the discovered gas, and by extension to the miniscule (by comparison) amount of energy used in its discovery.

#2 Currently in many mining operations in Australia staff are offered a FIFO option. Fly in Fly out. Staff fly in for a period of weeks... do long shifts then fly home. This is standard procedure. Sure it uses kero. But as stated above... as a percentage of the total energy used... How many workers do you think are going to be needed at such a plant?

Your comment about the length of the power lines is amusing... given that you obviously live in a county with a trans national power line system! Why is this criteria some insurmountable obstacle?

#3 Your criticism about IT materials applies to every other alternative power generation method. But personally, I doubt a near term shortage of silicon... it being the second most abundant element in the earths crust. To refine it we just need electricity. In silicon technology the elements to modify its behavior are used in sparing amounts. So steady up on that particular depletion argument.

The false dilemma you present is this. Until geothermal can produce all of the materials required to establish it, you view it as unfeasable and therefore unachievable.

If you were a chicken, your eggs would remain unhatched because you left the nest.

Thanks SP.

Some of the comments from the doomer fringe make well considered responses to peak oil hard to propagate, as people end up associating the whole idea of peak oil with this sort of ill-thought through fear mongering...

While I share some deep scepticism of purely technological/engineering solutions to environmental problems, and I think that some degree of "powering down" will go a long way to helping ease our energy dependency... dismissing prospective alternatives for reasons that border on ideology should be avoided.

It almost seems to be something of an article of faith that somehow, unless a technology/energy system is, on its first installation, capable of producing enough energy to produce all the necessary subsystems then it is impossible... as if this is some kind of valid EROEI argument.

Hi all, new to this forum, but 'ere goes.
I just watched a program on the Foxtel cable TV Geo chanel about geothermal activity in the USA town of Big Rock.

Apparently the instulation has been there for 17 years but hadn't gone on line due to one reason or another. At the time of viewing the plant has just gone on line and is producing something like 34 megawatts to the California grid.

The instulation consists of three drill holes that go about 3 or 4 KM deep and hit hot rocks where water is pumped down the middle borehole and steam is drawn from the other two to drive the turbo generators.

I wondered at the time if salt water could be pumped down to the hot rocks to get distilled water out for irrigation purposes, without the high energy input as required by conventional desalination plants.

Even if the salt came back up with the steam it would be removed as soon as the steam was condensed to water.

Anyone got any comments on the practicability of this?

I think I either saw the same program or something similar.

What you describe is Flash Distillation using the heat in the rocks to provide the heat.

It could be possible... but so far most of the surveyed hot rock resource in Oz appears to be some distance from the ocean.

Although reverse osmosis does use significant amounts of electricity, I think the actual energy consumption is less than that using flash distillation.

We shouldn't think that Geothermal is "free" and limitless...